[Catalist] Fwd: Re: Belief in Creationist Pseudoscience in Australia

Leon Harris leon at quoll.com
Thu Nov 23 02:27:15 AEDT 2017 

Well not from a flying spaghetti monster. Nor from any other being not 
supported by testable evidence.

Many, I suspect, haven't fully formed a view of who. At our current 
stage of cultural development, we are more focussed on working on how. 
At this time, we apparently can't see beyond the singularity of the big 
bang, but there is no evidence of a deity available between now and that 
point. If there were, scientists would be religious, because we deal in 
evidence.

When somebody discovers something, you are welcome to quote John 20:27 
to me. Until that time, scientists will mostly remain sceptical.



On 22/11/2017 11:05 PM, SAMUELS Norbert [Balga Senior High School] wrote:
>
> It could therefore be considered surprising that *almost 60% of 
> Australian adults believe that God or a supernatural being was behind 
> the universe and all life,* and the majority of these people do not 
> accept the well-established theory of evolution but believe that God 
> brought about this universe and life, fully developed and similar to 
> how we see it today, out of nothing.”
>
> Reference 1 URL: 
> https://www.plainreason.org/articles/survey-creationism-australia/ 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.plainreason.org%2Farticles%2Fsurvey-creationism-australia%2F&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=kW%2BVP2t3RRQFo2dKg7br%2FiX5lG3b9KQn2z6Yj%2FPGzZw%3D&reserved=0>
>
> So if creationist believe evryyhinh that we see today was brought 
> about from nothing.
>
> Where do evolutionist belive it came from?
>
>
>
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Gregory Munyard <gmunyard at iinet.net.au>
> Date: 22/11/17 11:21 am (GMT+08:00)
> To: catalist at lists.stawa.net
> Subject: Re: [Catalist] Belief in Creationist Pseudoscience in Australia
>
> Dear All
>
> What a pity we can’t be a bit more broad minded and accept that 
> evolution doesn’t actually provide ALL the answers to the orgins of 
> life (e.g. the “evolution” of DNA/ RNA polymerase, helicase, the whole 
> protein synthesis system – without protein synthesis there is no 
> polymerase), that there are many erroneous and fraudulent 
> discrepancies (Haeckel’s embryos, the Biston betularia scandal) and 
> that the science behind evolution is sadly lacking (we weren’t 
> actually there to see what happened, so it’s not observational 
> science). From my limited perspective, this post could equally be 
> entitled “Belief in Evolutionist Pseudoscience in Australia”.  Now, 
> let’s see the feathers fly.
>
> Regards
>
> Greg Munyard
>
> *From: *Catalist <catalist-bounces at lists.stawa.net> on behalf of Igor 
> Bray <igor.bray at curtin.edu.au>
> *Reply-To: *"catalist at lists.stawa.net" <catalist at lists.stawa.net>
> *Date: *Tuesday, 21 November 2017 at 10:41 am
> *To: *"catalist at lists.stawa.net" <catalist at lists.stawa.net>
> *Subject: *Re: [Catalist] Belief in Creationist Pseudoscience in Australia
>
> Dear All,
>
> I’d like to thank Michael McGarry for raising the issues below, and in 
> particular to those relating to the Australian Academy of Science. As 
> a new Fellow of the Academy (FAA) I have asked that the page at the 
> last link below be rewritten, and until this has been done, be removed 
> from the site. It has now been removed, and I hope to see the new 
> draft before it goes public.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Igor
>
> --
>
> Igor Bray, John Curtin Distinguished Professor
> PhD, FAPS, FInstP, FAIP, FAA
> Head | Physics, Astronomy and Medical Radiation Science
> Director | Theoretical Physics
>
> Curtin University, GPO Box U1987 Perth, Western Australia 6845
> Tel |+61 8 9266 7747
> Fax |+61 8 9266 2377
> Mobile |+61 4 0489 2862
>
> Email |_I.Bray at curtin.edu.au_
> Web Curtin |_http://curtin.edu.au 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fcurtin.edu.au%2F&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=%2BCRgVl7IO0eyy%2FC3TqyCGAXgeNC9QFAgkN1e65dnIyA%3D&reserved=0>__
> _Web Physics |http://physics.curtin.edu.au 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fphysics.curtin.edu.au&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=CccUHWgF39oWzubOeFtNxDU1YxbYYhxhUsAD6kkbqrI%3D&reserved=0>_
> _Web TP |_http://itp.curtin.edu.au 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fitp.curtin.edu.au%2F&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=f7G800NcNDWke4lGPX8gC2HP3nM%2FWhHFaiq6%2BYXYhEs%3D&reserved=0>
> _
>
> Curtin University is a trademark of Curtin University
> CRICOS Provider Code 00301J
>
> *From: *Catalist <catalist-bounces at lists.stawa.net 
> <mailto:catalist-bounces at lists.stawa.net>> on behalf of Michael 
> McGarry <mmcgarry44 at gmail.com <mailto:mmcgarry44 at gmail.com>>
> *Reply-To: *Catalist <catalist at lists.stawa.net 
> <mailto:catalist at lists.stawa.net>>
> *Date: *Saturday, 26 August 2017 8:45 am
> *To: *Catalist <catalist at lists.stawa.net 
> <mailto:catalist at lists.stawa.net>>
> *Subject: *[Catalist] Belief in Creationist Pseudoscience in Australia
>
> Greetings Science Colleagues,
>
> “It could therefore be considered surprising that *almost 60% of 
> Australian adults believe that God or a supernatural being was behind 
> the universe and all life,* and the majority of these people do not 
> accept the well-established theory of evolution but believe that God 
> brought about this universe and life, fully developed and similar to 
> how we see it today, out of nothing.”
>
> Reference 1 URL: 
> https://www.plainreason.org/articles/survey-creationism-australia/ 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.plainreason.org%2Farticles%2Fsurvey-creationism-australia%2F&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=kW%2BVP2t3RRQFo2dKg7br%2FiX5lG3b9KQn2z6Yj%2FPGzZw%3D&reserved=0>
>
> “Fundamentalist Christians believe their entire religious edifice will 
> crumble if they accept the raw facts of evolution.  The vast majority 
> of Christians fully embrace Darwin’s Theory, yet Creationists persist 
> with teaching their children the alarming myths of Genesis and the 
> “literal truths” of the Old Testament.”
>
> Reference 2 URL: 
> https://www.plainreason.org/articles/intelligent-design-id-and-irreducible-complexity-ic/ 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.plainreason.org%2Farticles%2Fintelligent-design-id-and-irreducible-complexity-ic%2F&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=Ew3hWX68jg4TSNJnhogStGbedPXZY1aEFBXTNpJJR1Y%3D&reserved=0>
>
> Why do 60% of Australian adults reject the Theory of Biological Evolution?
>
> *Hypothesis 1:*Do 60% of Australian adults *reject* the Theory of 
> Biological Evolution because: “In Australia’s public schools, students 
> are now routinely exposed to evangelism from very conservative 
> Christian groups?”
>
> “Marion Maddox uncovers the surprising impact of these groups on once 
> secular public schooling, and the ways in which governments have been 
> persuaded to support their cause.”
>
> Reference 3: 
> https://www.allenandunwin.com/browse/books/general-books/current-affairs-politics/Taking-God-to-School-Marion-Maddox-9781743315712 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.allenandunwin.com%2Fbrowse%2Fbooks%2Fgeneral-books%2Fcurrent-affairs-politics%2FTaking-God-to-School-Marion-Maddox-9781743315712&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=vTNjk%2BisRoehU5CFr0y19uSjAxVwlASVhL7vSEQCEkQ%3D&reserved=0>
>
> Marion Maddox URL: 
> http://www.mq.edu.au/about_us/faculties_and_departments/faculty_of_arts/mhpir/staff/staff-politics_and_international_relations/professor_marion_maddox/ 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mq.edu.au%2Fabout_us%2Ffaculties_and_departments%2Ffaculty_of_arts%2Fmhpir%2Fstaff%2Fstaff-politics_and_international_relations%2Fprofessor_marion_maddox%2F&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=bFhvWau3VPbdBfR91X3NebEBWTNJ8pxvDHqL3DzQVmE%3D&reserved=0>
>
> *Hypothesis 2:*Do 60% of Australian adults *reject* the Theory of 
> Biological Evolution because when students learn about biological 
> evolution in their science classes, students with fixed 
> religious-mindsets, ‘inherited’ from their parents and ‘churches’, 
> reject the scientific evidence for biological evolution?
>
> Religions and Australian Constitution Law and Politics
>
> Colleagues may find these two papers on the interplay of religions, 
> politics, and constitutional law in Australia most informative?
>
> ICLRS URL: https://www.iclrs.org/content/blurb/files/Australia.1.pdf 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.iclrs.org%2Fcontent%2Fblurb%2Ffiles%2FAustralia.1.pdf&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=ZOjxSEREV41aerOGtmkVmvbk3zybPuXB%2BuHQbomzIEo%3D&reserved=0>
>
> CAROLYN EVANS URL: 
> http://law.unimelb.edu.au/news/MLS/professor-carolyn-evans-appointed-deputy-vice-chancellor 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flaw.unimelb.edu.au%2Fnews%2FMLS%2Fprofessor-carolyn-evans-appointed-deputy-vice-chancellor&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=oU%2FHdLPR%2Fc0l2Uy5hhuXBo8JcJyNu6VVMMQQ9eVWS%2FU%3D&reserved=0>
>
> AUSTLII URL: 
> http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/journals/ANZLawHisteJl/2007/3.pdf 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.austlii.edu.au%2Fau%2Fjournals%2FANZLawHisteJl%2F2007%2F3.pdf&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=QOvwXhNZEOWzu84%2F%2FXlIH8u9yTLurLTu%2FNCS4isA8PQ%3D&reserved=0>
>
> CHARLOTTE BAINES URL: 
> http://adm.monash.edu/records-archives/archives/memo-archive/2004-2007/assets/includes/content/20100217/stories-around-monash3.html 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fadm.monash.edu%2Frecords-archives%2Farchives%2Fmemo-archive%2F2004-2007%2Fassets%2Fincludes%2Fcontent%2F20100217%2Fstories-around-monash3.html&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=NEbJAZoDmrOCW%2Fme7nAb8sgTFuGVjoX6FuaeiH5vKGM%3D&reserved=0>
>
> Religious Parents who refuse Medical Treatment for their sick Children
>
> AIFS URL: 
> https://aifs.gov.au/publications/citizen-child-australian-law-and-childrens-rights/8-medical-procedures-children 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Faifs.gov.au%2Fpublications%2Fcitizen-child-australian-law-and-childrens-rights%2F8-medical-procedures-children&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=nEpG1sUktxo2nfWJ%2F1yZAGCbGT6xaCEZTXPHxWE%2BJYk%3D&reserved=0>
>
> AVANT URL: 
> http://www.avant.org.au/news/20151103-court-intervenes-in-non-urgent-situation-for-child-of-jehovahs-witness-parents/ 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.avant.org.au%2Fnews%2F20151103-court-intervenes-in-non-urgent-situation-for-child-of-jehovahs-witness-parents%2F&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=KOh2d1ZGlYUupOhem7MFCKfdt32urrBtF7IBjFzbLJc%3D&reserved=0>
>
> KEMH URL: 
> http://www.kemh.health.wa.gov.au/development/manuals/O&G_guidelines/sectionb/2/b2.14.pdf 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.kemh.health.wa.gov.au%2Fdevelopment%2Fmanuals%2FO%26G_guidelines%2Fsectionb%2F2%2Fb2.14.pdf&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=4X7TUvFwt9s%2FpFQBse1lrqo0t%2B9ZdBXRXgOu%2BMNa2XY%3D&reserved=0>
>
> ABC URL: 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-04-15/christian-scientists-exempt-from-new-vaccination-laws/6395480 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.abc.net.au%2Fnews%2F2015-04-15%2Fchristian-scientists-exempt-from-new-vaccination-laws%2F6395480&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=nWo0cCfvf0UBiNr7meGJt%2Bk%2BCylq4y1btNRn5tbebrY%3D&reserved=0>
>
> *Question:*Given that 60% of Australian adults *reject* the Theory of 
> Biological Evolution, should the Australian Academy of Science 
> *delete* this sentence from their 2005 ‘position statement’ on the 
> teaching of creationist pseudoscience in Australian schools?
>
> “The [Australian] Academy [of Science] sees no objection to the 
> teaching of creationism in schools as part of a course in dogmatic or 
> comparative religion, or in some other non-scientific context.”
>
> AAS Reference URL: 
> https://www.science.org.au/supporting-science/science-policy/position-statements/creationism-and-intelligent-design 
> <https://apac01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.science.org.au%2Fsupporting-science%2Fscience-policy%2Fposition-statements%2Fcreationism-and-intelligent-design&data=02%7C01%7CNorbert.Samuels%40education.wa.edu.au%7C0d121db9d2b04814cd2d08d531582411%7Ce08016f9d1fd4cbb83b0b76eb4361627%7C0%7C0%7C636469177019645511&sdata=1PZcDiNZGGtmJeNPVQHKaawOaxR3sgc%2FIJOJU6SXIlY%3D&reserved=0>
>
> Thanks and Best Wishes,
>
> Michael John McGarry
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Catalist mailing list
> Catalist at lists.stawa.net
> http://lists.stawa.net/mailman/listinfo/catalist_lists.stawa.net


-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.stawa.net/pipermail/catalist_lists.stawa.net/attachments/20171122/81813db1/attachment.html>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: image001.png
Type: image/png
Size: 9364 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://lists.stawa.net/pipermail/catalist_lists.stawa.net/attachments/20171122/81813db1/attachment.png>

More information about the Catalist mailing list